Episode Chronological Order Changes
Okay, thought I'd make a section for episode order changes that aren't important enough for the main page. That said, I changed Trading Faces to come before Car Alarm, as Kim still has to wait for rides in this episode. —Unsigned comment added by 126.96.36.199 (talk • contribs)
- Seems reasonable to me. —RRabbit42 (leave a message) 16:01, February 23, 2011 (UTC)
- It doesn't quite work for a few reasons. The first one is that Kim has a ride in "Homecoming Upset". The second reason is that Ron has a dollar bill with him in "Trading Faces". But, "The Big Job" depicts him as flat broke. And, the third reason is Bonnie's reaction to Jim and Tim. So, you can't have it both ways. Erased Paper (talk) 22:52, October 13, 2013 (UTC)
How do you know the chronological order is correct? -DoomScarf 14:37, April 18, 2012 (UTC)
- I have to agree with this question. To me the production order should be taken as the chronological order unless there is positive proof that a change needs to be made. For instance, it is obvious that "Tick-Tick-Tick" took place before "Beuno Nacho" because Kim and Ron had never met Drakken or Shego in "Tick-Tick-Tick", but had in "Bueno Nacho". Every instance of an episode being moved out of production order needs this type of reasoning given.
- Too many of these changes have no given reason. That is bad, from my perspective.
Mknopp 14:51, April 18, 2012 (UTC)
- There was a lot of duplicate and contradictory information about the order the episodes were made in and their in-series chronology. I got it straightened out and consolidated the best I could. I don't know if we ever had an official source for the production codes, though. – RRabbit42 (leave a message) 00:53, April 19, 2012 (UTC)
- I completely understand about just getting it cleaned up at the time, and I think it is great that you did that. I also don't think that it is a major deal. That is why it is low on my list.
- As for production number. I have a lot of the episodes (all but season 2) downloaded from iTunes, which has the information entered by Disney. The production numbers we have are the same as those that I have in iTunes. So, I would say that the production numbers are accurate.
- Mknopp 02:15, April 19, 2012 (UTC)
What's with Kim's cameo in Phineas and Ferb 
Okay, a few suggestions for changes.
First, the production order and the production number are redundant. We should eliminate the production order column.
Second, given how much we are stressing canon now I am really in favor of removing the chronological order column. Not only is so much of it subjective, but presented as it is there is no way to actually explain the reasons from canon that support it. If we want to keep the chronology then I would say that it should be merged into the individual episode articles, or it should be moved into its own article where the reasons can be better explained and referenced.
Third, I would like to see us add a column for Disney Media order. This is the order that Disney presents the episodes on DVDs or iTunes. To me this is the best indication of how the creators want the show's episodes to be ordered, as it doesn't line up exactly with US broadcast order or production order.
Fourth, I think that the Media order should be the default sort order and not the US broadcast order. Since, other nations likely did not have the same production order, and other than when some executive decided it would be best to release a particular episode it is pretty much meaningless to anything dealing with the show.
First, Production Order is production order, regardless of the country to which the show was exported to for airing. Production Code 101 or 217 shall *always* be those production codes as that is how they were ordered made, if not how they were aired wherever.
Having an internal-cues Chrono order listing of my own (based upon ErasedPaper's), I'd like to see a page devoted to discussing Chrono Order.
I disagree that Media Release is indicative of how the creators wanted it. They already admit or copped out that continuity was accidental, so I don't see it that way. The Disney Channel (US) routinely repeated Airdate order on their episode rotations with the blatant exception of holiday-themed episodes. Mother's Day was *only* ever aired around Mother's Day (in fact, they totes skipped the last Mother's Day airing in US just prior to dropping the show from the line-up). Christmas ep was *only* ever seen in December, if several times, etc.
Then there are themed Media Releases; Secret Files; Villain Files; Monkey Business; etc. which doesn't count the "Bonus Episodes" so released which found their way onto the Airing Line-up. Finally the Complete Seasons 1 & 2 US DVDs (not sure of the German releases years prior) are in US Airdate order.
So I'd recommend sticking to *either* Airing(US) or Production Code orders. I stipulate US Airing as that parallels other aspects of the Wiki where because it is an American Show set in America, we default to American details such as spelling and class names.
My 2 euros worth…
I agree that the production number will always be the production number and is by far the best way to refer to an episode numerically. However, the table posted on this page has *both* production number (101, 102, 201, etc) and a completely redundant production order (1, 2, 3, etc.). All the information necessary to determine the production order is already available in the production number so there is no reason to the have the production order column.
Perhaps it isn't how the creators wanted it, as we don't really know that they had anything to do with it. However, I find it interesting that the order of the episodes on the DVDs and iTunes is different than the air date order, which we know was completely screwed up by executive meddling as to be considered a joke for determining any sort of reasonable order. The media order actually sticks closer to actual production order, which we also know isn't perfect for determining order, but is worlds better than US air date.
I find a difference in sticking with American details because it is an American show and using the random order that the episodes were released in the US as some form of meaningful anything. Especially, when you consider that some episodes were actually aired overseas before they were in the US, again due to executive meddling. Air date is always a terrible way to order any show, because it is so dependent on country by country things like DVD releases and holidays and such, as you mentioned earlier.
Regarding chrono order. An article would be okay, as long as we can keep it canonically founded. I just hate it in this table because there is no way to know why an episode was placed where it was. Although, I do fear that a chrono order article will devolve into a lot of personal interpretation, but I say we try it and see.
And we are now at 4 euros... ;)
Clearly, what is there now is not correct. This list below is actually what I've done in 2007.
Most "errors" here are inherent to the show itself. In "Downhill", there is no actual mention of winter.
- 01. Tick-Tick-Tick / 02. Bueno Nacho / 03. Monkey Fist Strikes / 04. Attack of the Killer Bebes / 05. The New Ron / 06. Mind Games / 07. Royal Pain / 08. The Twin Factor / 09. Animal Attraction / 10. All the News / 11. Sink or Swim / 12. Number One / 13. Crush / 14. Monkey Ninjas in Space / 15. Low Budget / 16. Downhill / 17. Coach Possible / 18. Pain King vs. Cleopatra / 19. Kimitation Nation / 20. Lilo & Stitch: Rufus (or, skip it) / 20. Ron the Man / 21. October 31st
- 22. The Ron Factor / 23. Partners / 24. Grudge Match / 25. Virtu-Ron / 26. Two to Tutor / 27. Naked Genius / 28. Rufus in Show / Adventures in Rufus-Sitting / 29. The Fearless Ferret / 30. Motor Ed / 31. Job Unfair / 32. The Golden Years / 33. Car Trouble / 34. Queen Bebe / 35. Go Team Go / 36. Mother's Day / 37. Rufus vs. Commodore Puddles / Day of the Snowmen / 38. Showdown at the Crooked D / 39. Present / 40. Past / 41. Future / 42. Hidden Talent / 43. Return to Wannaweep / 44. A Very Possible Christmas / 45. Blush / 46. The Full Monkey / 47. Exchange / 48. Oh Boyz / 49. Triple S / 50. Ron Millionaire / 51. Rewriting History / 52. Sick Day / The Truth Hurts
- 53. Steal Wheels / 54. Emotion Sickness / 55. Bonding / 56. Bad Boy / 57. Dimension Twist / 58. Overdue / Roachie / 59. And the Molerat Will Be CGI / 60. Rappin' Drakken / 61. Gorilla Fist / 62. Team Impossible / 63. So the Drama, Part 1 / 64. So the Drama, Part 2 / 65. So the Drama, Part 3
- 66. Ill-Suited / 67. Car Alarm / 68. Trading Faces / 69. The Big Job / 70. Mad Dogs and Aliens / 71. Fashion Victim / 72. Grande Size Me / 73. The Cupid Effect / 74. Big Bother / 75. Clothes Minded / 76. Odds Man In / 77. Mathter and Fervent / 78. Clean Slate / 79. Homecoming Upset / 80. Stop Team Go / 81. Cap'n Drakken / 82. The Mentor of Our Discontent / 83. Larry's Birthday / 84. Oh No! Yono! / 85. Chasing Rufus / Nursery Crimes / 86. Graduation, Part 1 / 87. Graduation, Part 2